The John W. Loftus Hall of High Level Discussion

 

 

The following are extracts from John W. Loftus’s participation at TheologyWeb.com.  Click on the links for the full post.

 

 

June 16th, 2005 , 03:48 PM

http://www.theologyweb.com/campus/showpost.php?p=1073936&postcount=85

Is there such a thing as an honest doubter?

 

This is just interesting to me. And it treats me unfairly. And I'm not crying over it, either, JP. I'm just pointing out that this is definitely not a high level discussion. Sometimes it is a high school level of interchange.

 

 

July 25th, 2005 , 04:39 AM

http://www.theologyweb.com/campus/showpost.php?p=1127660&postcount=1

Parting Thoughts From Doubting John


This is not the place for any high level discussion or debate, so I am out of here.

 

 

June 29th, 2005, 05:38 PM

http://www.theologyweb.com/campus/showpost.php?p=1092492&postcount=54

Where is God in Infinite SPACE?

 

I refuse to be brought down to your high school mentality,

 

 

July 2nd, 2005, 09:56 PM

http://www.theologyweb.com/campus/showpost.php?p=1097106&postcount=75

Where is God in Infinite SPACE?

 

But ridicule is likewise an informal logical fallacy, and several Christians have resorted to that. To ridicule is not to make an argument at all.

 

 

July 8th, 2005, 11:17 PM

http://www.theologyweb.com/campus/showpost.php?p=1105442&postcount=34

Nominate the most Intellectual Twebbers

 

Ya see, for me it's not worth staying in a high level argument with people like that.

 

 

July 23rd 2005, 10:31 PM

http://www.theologyweb.com/campus/showpost.php?p=1126679&postcount=1

I Think All Christians Are Idiots!

“Made ya look ya dirty crook.”
I just want to see how many hits this thread will initially get.

P.S. I'm not serious.
P.S.S. What I mean by the “P.S.” is that I really don't think all Christians are idiots.
P.S.S.S. Any questions?
P.S.S.S.S Just laugh.

 

 

July 5th, 2005, 03:46 AM http://www.theologyweb.com/campus/showpost.php?p=1099167&postcount=23

Can a Historical Religion Be Believed?

 

Here's a funny argument:

Roses are red;
violets are blue;
God doesn't exist;
and neither do you.

That's funny too, no?
Or this one with no premises--just a conclusion:
You are wrong!
Now that's mildly funny, heh, heh, an argument with no premises. I liked it.

 

 

July 5th, 2005, 07:14 PM
http://www.theologyweb.com/campus/showpost.php?p=1100230&postcount=23

Jesus Was Not Born of a Virgin in Bethlehem!

 

Well, well, well kids! Sometimes this is indeed funny, and it's okay to laugh a little, because we're debating such serious subjects. I made a goof. I don't know how to correct it, either. Which makes it even funnier, I suppose.

Well then, just ignore everything I said, because I goofed. I suppose that's better than dealing with the argument itself, and it makes you feel better too!

Have fun. Go run in the sprinkler a little bit; come inside and have a lollipop, then take a nap (if you can after the lollipop), and when you get up from that I'll fix you a peanut butter sandwich. Then we'll watch Mr. Rogers (if it's on), and play with your lego set before your mom comes home from working.

 

 

July 7th, 2005, 03:40 AM

http://www.theologyweb.com/campus/showpost.php?p=1102315&postcount=86

Submit Your Candidates for July Screwballs of the Month

 

Thanks for the nomination for my thread, “Jesus was not born a virgin in Bethlehem.”

But wait!

Maybe, Jesus was born in sin after all!

Thank You.  Thank you very much......

Do I get a trophy if I win?

Should I drum up some support.....vote for DJ.

“DJ is your man,
If he can't make you to doubt...
Then nobody one can.”

I liked that.

But actually, I nominate Tophet for some of the nasty things she's been saying in two spearate [sic] threads: “Where is God in Infinite Space,” and, “Is there such a thing as an honest doubter.”

As Christians you should shun her. She's the kind of person whom Jascha Heifetz wrote about when he said: “No matter what side of an argument you're on, you always find some people on your side that you wish were on the other side.” Heh, heh.

She simply lacks in understanding. She couldn't even convince her own mother that she had wet her pants. Nor would she be able to understand her mother when she responds, “Go to the bathroom.”

By the way, I'm not a hypocrite when I rarely trash people like Tophet as a person. I never said I cared for her in the first place, and I simply don't have any commands to love my (intellectual) enemies, like she does. But she is a hypocrite--most definitely.

And so......drum roll......let's hear it for Tophet.

Screwball of the month!

But since she's on your side of the argument, you won't agree with the truth.....because.............



scroll down....












more........
















“YOU CAN'T HANDLE THE TRUTH!”

(Jack Nicholson--remember the movie?

Now go out and ride your bicycles, and when you're done I'll read you a story called, “See Spot Run.” Afterward I'll let you have a lollipop and you can watch cartoons for the afternoon.

 

 

 

July 7th, 2005, 08:48 PM

http://www.theologyweb.com/campus/showpost.php?p=1103693&postcount=98

Submit Your Candidates for July Screwballs of the Month

 

Okay, I've searched and I figure this quote from Tophet will suffice for me to nominate him as the screwball of the month. It's located on page 8 of the thread “Is There Such a Thing As An Honest Doubter?”

To get the full levity of this you may want to trudge though the whole thread if you have the time.

Tophet's false dilemna [sic] to me:


Therefore, if you do not respond to all the questions I have asked of you in this thread and in “Where is God in INFINITE SPACE?” you concede my points.

You concede that you are a liar.
You concede that you are a hypocrite.
You concede that you are a coward.
You concede you are ignorant about Christianity.
You concede that you are mentally deficient.
You concede that you blame other people for your own failures.
You concede that you engage in a double standard in the evaluation of logic.
You concede that you engage in a double standard in the evaluation of history.

I await your response with wry amusement.


The funny thing is that he doesn't realize that this is a false dilemna. [sic] Either respond or you concede! Ha. That's a real hoot. If you're fair then you must think so too!

Come on, you can laugh with me about this, even though it's one of your own, can't you?

By the way, I cannot be a hypocrite, because I do not have the same Christian standards that Christians do. I live my life according to my ethical principles almost 100% of the time. My ethical demands are reasonable to live by, whereas the ethical demands of Christians are higher than anyone could ever do--and don't mention Jesus here to me, either, because that is your faith statment [sic] about something I do not believe.

-----------------------------

JP Holding is my nomination for this award if Tophet cannot fulfill the responsibilities of being the screwball of the month (is he supposed to wear a dunce cap through the streets of Wheaton?).

Imagine that, the starter of this thread being one who is nominated!? Cool!

Well, then, just in case Tophet needs replaced because he's just too stupid to fulfill the responsibilities [that is, he thinks the dunce cap is something you use to urinate in, and thinks Wheaton is a place in Kansas that weighs wheat], here's a quote from JPH:

Oh, first some background info. In the thread: “Where is God in Infinite Space?” I said, “the idiots have found me” by which I was referring to Holding and his girl Tophet.

Okay, up to snuff now?

Holding accused me of using an “Ad Hominem argument” there.

But what exactly made him think I was offering an argument? He sees arguments when someone sneezes?

“Hahhhh chooooo”

Oh, excuse me.

I was venting, not making an argument at all, so to save face in the face of his TWEB peers, he responded that he thinks I am always venting, or something like that.

Nice Save JP. But the “save” as well as the initial comment are mildy funny-- a pie-in-your-face type of thing.

 

 

July 8th, 2005, 09:55 PM http://www.theologyweb.com/campus/showpost.php?p=1105378&postcount=9

Does God Foreknow The Future?

 

Hey stupid. I hold the copyright.

 

 

July 8th, 2005, 04:55 PM http://www.theologyweb.com/campus/showpost.php?p=1104911&postcount=7

Nominate the most irritating TWEBber.

 

Thank You!


Thank you very much!


Do I get an award...or a trophy?


I really was just going to post a few things and get some intelligent discussions going. But when I was grossly misunderstood and personally attacked I decided to leave this site. But then I realized that there are people like Tophet on this site who's [sic] self-proclaimed mission is to irritate doubters like me so that I will leave this site. That's when I decided to do the opposite of what they wanted me to do, and I posted things with a vengeance. ...


Anyway, I nominate Tophet.


Tophet is an idiot, and in the thread “Screwballs of the month” I say why.

Tophet
Tophet
Tophet
Tophet

There, that'll draw her attention to this thread next time she does a search.

 

 

July 9th, 2005, 04:30 PM http://www.theologyweb.com/campus/showpost.php?p=1106187&postcount=43

Nominate the most irritating TWEBber.

 

Once again, I nominate Tophet.
Tophet
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Tophet
Tophet
Tophet
Tophet
Tophet
Tophet
Tophet
Tophet
Tophet
Tophet
Tophet
Tophet
Tophet
Tophet
Tophet
Tophet
Tophet
Tophet
Tophet
Tophet
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Tophet
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Tophet
Tophet
Tophet
Tophet

 

 

 

July 9th, 2005, 04:34 PM

http://www.theologyweb.com/campus/showpost.php?p=1106195&postcount=44

Nominate the most irritating TWEBber.

Response posted by “A Cup of Mystery”:

 

Ah, the lovely sounds of obsession.

 

 

July 9th, 2005, 04:36 PM

http://www.theologyweb.com/campus/showpost.php?p=1106199&postcount=45

Nominate the most irritating TWEBber.

Response posted by “Darth Executor”:

 

Click image for larger version

Name:  cryriver.jpg
Views: 1
Size:  18.2 KB

 

 

July 9th, 2005, 04:40 PM http://www.theologyweb.com/campus/showpost.php?p=1106204&postcount=46

Nominate the most irritating TWEBber.
Response posted by “Teallaura”:

 

And managing to win the title in the process....
How annoying!

 



July 9th, 2005, 02:55 PM http://www.theologyweb.com/campus/showpost.php?p=1106069&postcount=43

Nominate the most Intellectual Twebbers

 

Bad bad Darth.


Say, have you slain any “Darth's” lately?


They only seem to be multiplying.


Keep trying and maybe you're [sic] pea shooter might actually travel a couple of feet before the pea falls to the ground.

 

 

July 9th, 2005, 04:14 PM

http://www.theologyweb.com/campus/showpost.php?p=1106176&postcount=133

Submit Your Candidates for July Screwballs of the Month

 

Tophet,

 

You're funny. Anyone who compares what you write to what I write will know that you're a joke.

But the joke's on you.


You just don't realize it.

Which makes it even funnier.

Just keep it up.

Dig your own grave, stupid little girl.

 

 

July 9th, 2005, 04:27 PM

http://www.theologyweb.com/campus/showpost.php?p=1106186&postcount=131

Is there such a thing as an honest doubter?


Here I sit as a lion in the forrest [sic], and you are like a gnat buzzing around me.
Buzz away.

 

 

July 9th, 2005, 05:01 PM

http://www.theologyweb.com/campus/showpost.php?p=1106236&postcount=48

Nominate the most irritating TWEBber.

Response posted by “Tophet”:

 

Quote: Originally posted by Doubting John

 

Tophet,
Here I sit as a lion in the forrest, and you are like a gnat buzzing around me.

 

 

 

And you're letting out a great big roar, too!

I guess I am irritating, at that.

P.S. You will learn how to spell “forest,” won't you, John?

P.P.S. What was that you said, earlier?

From
http://www.theologyweb.com/campus/showpost.php?p=1092492&postcount=54

 


June 19th, 2006, 07:39 AM
http://www.theologyweb.com/campus/showpost.php?p=1536449&postcount=103
Re: Visions vs. Expectations: Holding's Argument

You know that I don't generally insult people who with disagree with me.

... I long for a completely satisfying answer to the meaning of this existence, although, I would settle for an answer that clearly wins out in the marketplace of ideas. But there isn't one, even if I think atheism is a better answer than other answers That's no reason to insult people who disagree with you.

 

December 28th, 2006, 10:40 PM
http://www.theologyweb.com/campus/showpost.php?p=1778045&postcount=62

2006 Platinum Screwball Awards: Preliminaries

 

You are an idiot. I mean it. You are an idiot.

December 28th, 2006, 10:41 PM
http://www.theologyweb.com/campus/s...48&postcount=63

2006 Platinum Screwball Awards: Preliminaries

 

You too are an idiot.

 

January 4th, 2007, 03:11 AM http://www.theologyweb.com/campus/showpost.php?p=1789400&postcount=1

The Arrogance of JP Holding and his Pied Pipers!

 

It's clear to all knowledgeable people that only a person having a small understanding of the issues will argue as if those who disagree are stupid.

When I retort in kind that the people who argue this way are stupid it's because they truly are ignorant about the fact that intelligent people just disagree.

And since intelligent people understand this, then they can disagree without all of the ad hominems. Educated people can disagree and still respect each other as persons.

 

... The only other reason for all of the ad hominems is a psychological need to appear to be better than others, and that's arrogance, plain and simple.

No educated and/or intelligent person will claim their arguments carry more force than they really do.

Our disagreements here are not between the intelligent people and the stupid people, depending on which side you agree with, although there truly is some of that on both sides.

Just a reality check, that's all.

 

January 4th, 2007, 08:25 AM

http://www.theologyweb.com/campus/showpost.php?p=1789767&postcount=13

The Arrogance of JP Holding and his Pied Pipers!

 

You don't understand the slightest of distinctions, and that reveals a certain level of ignorance that can be described as stupid.

For instance:

Just because someone disagrees with me does not make that person's arguments stupid, and vice versa.

The person who calls another person stupid simply because she disagrees with him is revealing a level of ignorance that is best described as stupid.

The lesson:

The more you understand the opponents' arguments, the less you can attribute them to stupidity.

Although, in certain cases, some people who make arguments that we disagree with may be described as stupid if they are clearly obtuse.

 

January 4th, 2007, 12:20 PM

http://www.theologyweb.com/campus/showpost.php?p=1790274&postcount=106

The Arrogance of JP Holding and his Pied Pipers!

 

Nick is an ignorant person who thinks he's intelligent. In moments of frustration what would you call him?

 

January 4th, 2007, 11:44 AM

http://www.theologyweb.com/campus/showpost.php?p=1790189&postcount=98

The Arrogance of JP Holding and his Pied Pipers!

 

How about YOU Nick?

Obtuse, eh?

No wonder I have trouble with you. It's just not me, is it?

 

January 4th 2007, 12:34 PM

http://www.theologyweb.com/campus/showpost.php?p=1790304&postcount=116 

 

No one but the ignorant would claim that I am ignorant.

 

To me Nick is just like a very bad Karaoke singer but doesn't know he is one, so he continues to badly sing out his song of arguments.

Because he's handicapped, Christians here won't tell him otherwise. He's going to study to be an apologist, but he will fall flat on his face.

 

 

 

Quote: Originally posted by Doubting John

 

I refuse to be brought down to your high school mentality,

 

 

 

July 1st, 2005, 09:01 PM

http://www.theologyweb.com/campus/showpost.php?p=1095924&postcount=71

Where is God in Infinite SPACE?

Response posted by “Furor”:

 

Mr. Loftus, to be perfectly frank, it staggers the imagination that a Christian minister with the credentials you boast could have become bogged down in such worthless problems as you appear to have been. One is reminded of the lion with a thorn in his paw, but without any of the romance or high moral content.

What lies beyond space, or Space, or SPACE?

Who cares?

It is not something of which we have any understanding at all, articles in the New York Times notwithstanding. It is functionally irrelevant. What if there's a race of beings on a planet orbiting Alpha Centauri that claims God doesn't exist? What if there isn't?

These questions are not, I must reiterate, the sort of thing that should captivate any reasonable man.

Now, I am not a former minister or student of William Lane Craig. Of course, I am not a spiteful lapsed Christian with an axe to grind, either. With the playing field thus leveled, I am moved to ask: what on earth happened to you? What was it that made these ridiculous gnats appear to be worthy of your straining? What would make a Christian man spit in the eye of the very world? The mind reels.

In closing, I am forced to wonder just what you had hoped to accomplish with this thread. No competent Christian will ever be swayed by arguments to the effect that a naturalistic explanation for something has not been found; the supernatural is enough. No competent Christian will ever be moved by the complaint that God does not respond to prayers or manifest Himself; to be perfectly blunt, he knows this is simply nonsense. The sort of material we have seen here might be of the type necessary to sway the hesitant, or the lazy, or the dull. The hyena feasts on the young, the sick, and the helpless.

The lion takes what he pleases. You, Mr. Loftus, are no lion.